老钱： 美国大选，选谁？ (一)不要搞社会主义

引用第91楼一剪梅于2012-09-30 20:48发表的 回 90楼(游客) 的帖子 :
   ALL MEN CREATED EQUAL! ALL MONEY EARNED EQUAL!

Sorry, not all men are created equal.  Someone is smarter than the other.  Someone is more athletic than the other.  Only one gold medal can be awarded in any Olympic event (occasionally, it can be tied).  Are we created equal, NO since I can even get to Olympics no matter how hard I try!  All men are created equal is just an ideal, not reality.  It should be only all men are treated equal in front of the law.  This is almost true in America and we are still trying to reach that.  

All money earned equal?  May be, if they earned legally.  If this is true, then, why we tax income differently?  Why 47% not paying any taxes?  Why middle classes have to pay more?  There is unfair treatment in our income tax code.  However, capital gain tax and estate tax is a bit different from most other incomes since they have already been taxed before as earned income.  Of course you can say why interest income is taxed at ordinary income.  True, this is unfair and can be debated.  In terms capital gain taxes, there is short term and long-term capital gains.  Only the long-term capital gains are taxed at lower taxes since the tax code is trying to encourage investment not speculation.  It is much more complicated debate on tax law.  However, I do need point out there are money which is been taxed before and there are money which is never been taxed.  That's why we have a different point of view depend on how you want to them to be treated.  

But no matter how you look at it, we are paying way too much tax than we should.  Higher taxes make government bigger and created more waste.  Just look at any government offices, how inefficient most of the employees are!  We are following Greece, Spain, and Italy's footstep.  The only reason we are not bankrupt yet is that US dollar is a world reserve currency and Fed can print as they wish.  When the day that world loses confidence in our currency, that would be the day of wakening!

91 楼〉〉Why 47% not paying any taxes?

This the biggest myth about poor working people's tax payment. Social security and medicaid tax take a bigger portion of low income people's pay check than high income people's. Since SS and medicate tax are going into the same general fund as other tax, not in separated accounts for their own purpose. When it comes to budget cutting, SS and medicate are not safe neither. So there is no guarantee that you get you SS/Med tax back no matter you are rich or poor. Now tell me how SS/Med tax is different from general income tax?

And you are still saying lower 47% not paying any taxes?

热闹呀，闹心呀。选谁？喜欢谁？
静下心来，想想，都在瞎折腾。在我们传统的Georgia，你那神圣的一票根本就不圣神。与共产党的中国选举一样，结果早就知道了。你是Conservatives， 投不投票，Romney都会拿到那圣神的16票。你是Liberals， 你投不投票，Obama都会以失败告终，这神圣的16票不会给他一票。你既不是Conservatives又不是Liberals，那你.....，你对这玩意也不感兴趣。
Georgia的票民们，别争啦，有这精神气，找那些斯文营州的竞选网站，发发牢骚，没准能为你们的心上人争上几票，甚至几十票。
如果真的想让你那神圣衣一票起点作用，赶紧搬到那些斯文营州去，四年后，你也可以随手斯文营。

169

引用第94楼游客于2012-09-30 23:21发表的 Re:回 90楼(游客) 的帖子 :


Sorry, not all men are created equal.  Someone is smarter than the other.  Someone is more athletic than the other.  Only one gold medal can be awarded in any Olympic event (occasionally, it can be tied).  Are we created equal, NO since I can even get to Olympics no matter how hard I try!  All men are created equal is just an ideal, not reality.  It should be only all men are treated equal in front of the law.  This is almost true in America and we are still trying to reach that.  

All money earned equal?  May be, if they earned legally.  If this is true, then, why we tax income differently?  Why 47% not paying any taxes?  Why middle classes have to pay more?  There is unfair treatment in our income tax code.  However, capital gain tax and estate tax is a bit different from most other incomes since they have already been taxed before as earned income.  Of course you can say why interest income is taxed at ordinary income.  True, this is unfair and can be debated.  In terms capital gain taxes, there is short term and long-term capital gains.  Only the long-term capital gains are taxed at lower taxes since the tax code is trying to encourage investment not speculation.  It is much more complicated debate on tax law.  However, I do need point out there are money which is been taxed before and there are money which is never been taxed.  That's why we have a different point of view depend on how you want to them to be treated.  
.......

现在的政府用了多少开支？共和党执政时打仗用了多少纳税人的钱？打仗到底为了什么？看看共和党总统《布什家族的战争》长篇纪实连载。就知道布什父子两代总统是如何为自己的私利不顾一切地把美国及其盟友拖进战争状态，而且至今为止，战争死了多少美国年轻的孩子？花了多少美国人的血汗钱？没有一个政客能说清“伊拉克战争”的最后结局。共和党执政期间花完了国库，战争到底为了什么？不就是为了少数石油富豪们吗？富豪们独揽着人类共同的财富，赚着大把大把的钱，自己捅了篓子还要政府买单，有像墨西哥湾石油泄露一样，不仅污染了人类共有的环境。共和党政府还给了大笔补贴。还有共和党总统布什的弟弟执政的华尔街银行破产，共和党政府也是给数目不菲的补贴。而他们仍然享受数千万元的高薪。那可都是我们纳税人的血汗钱啊！还有很多很多的例子。看看共和党执政都为国家做了什么，为广大的民众做了了什么？共和党就是为少数富豪们服务的政府。作为一名美国公民应该了解真正的是非，关心国家的命运和个人利益，不能事不关己高高挂起，拿出你神圣的一票投向公正。

事实如此，美国的选举制度造成只有摇摆州的选票才被看中，其他州的选民只能出钱陪演。

引用第97楼游客于2012-10-01 07:28发表的  :
热闹呀，闹心呀。选谁？喜欢谁？
静下心来，想想，都在瞎折腾。在我们传统的Georgia，你那神圣的一票根本就不圣神。与共产党的中国选举一样，结果早就知道了。你是Conservatives， 投不投票，Romney都会拿到那圣神的16票。你是Liberals， 你投不投票，Obama都会以失败告终，这神圣的16票不会给他一票。你既不是Conservatives又不是Liberals，那你.....，你对这玩意也不感兴趣。
Georgia的票民们，别争啦，有这精神气，找那些斯文营州的竞选网站，发发牢骚，没准能为你们的心上人争上几票，甚至几十票。
如果真的想让你那神圣衣一票起点作用，赶紧搬到那些斯文营州去，四年后，你也可以随手斯文营。

引用第97楼游客于2012-10-01 07:28发表的  :
热闹呀，闹心呀。选谁？喜欢谁？
静下心来，想想，都在瞎折腾。在我们传统的Georgia，你那神圣的一票根本就不圣神。与共产党的中国选举一样，结果早就知道了。你是Conservatives， 投不投票，Romney都会拿到那圣神的16票。你是Liberals， 你投不投票，Obama都会以失败告终，这神圣的16票不会给他一票。你既不是Conservatives又不是Liberals，那你.....，你对这玩意也不感兴趣。
Georgia的票民们，别争啦，有这精神气，找那些斯文营州的竞选网站，发发牢骚，没准能为你们的心上人争上几票，甚至几十票。
如果真的想让你那神圣衣一票起点作用，赶紧搬到那些斯文营州去，四年后，你也可以随手斯文营。

好，这得说给GA红脖子们听。

169

引用第93楼游客于2012-09-30 22:31发表的 Re:Re:回 70楼(游客) 的帖子 :


同意71楼对一剪梅的批评, 一剪梅有点反常了，太激动了。
合法就是合法,非法就是非法. 那还有什么"基本"不"基本"的.

这事放在谁身上都会生气，那可是一辈子的血汗钱呐。

169

现在的政府用了多少开支？共和党执政时打仗用了多少纳税人的钱？打仗到底为了什么？看看共和党总统《布什家族的战争》长篇纪实连载。就知道布什父子两代总统是如何为自己的私利不顾一切地把美国及其盟友拖进战争状态，而且至今为止，战争死了多少美国年轻的孩子？花了多少美国人的血汗钱？没有一个政客能说清“伊拉克战争”的最后结局。共和党执政期间花完了国库，战争到底为了什么？不就是为了少数石油富豪们吗？富豪们独揽着人类共同的财富，赚着大把大把的钱，自己捅了篓子还要政府买单，有像墨西哥湾石油泄露一样，不仅污染了人类共有的环境。共和党政府还给了大笔补贴。还有共和党总统布什的弟弟执政的华尔街银行破产，共和党政府也是给数目不菲的补贴。而他们仍然享受数千万元的高薪。那可都是我们纳税人的血汗钱啊！还有很多很多的例子。看看共和党执政都为国家做了什么，为广大的民众做了了什么？共和党就是为少数富豪们服务的政府。作为一名美国公民应该了解真正的是非，关心国家的命运和个人利益，不能事不关己高高挂起，拿出你神圣的一票投向公正。

引用第95楼游客于2012-10-01 00:51发表的  :
91 楼〉〉Why 47% not paying any taxes?

This the biggest myth about poor working people's tax payment. Social security and medicaid tax take a bigger portion of low income people's pay check than high income people's. Since SS and medicate tax are going into the same general fund as other tax, not in separated accounts for their own purpose. When it comes to budget cutting, SS and medicate are not safe neither. So there is no guarantee that you get you SS/Med tax back no matter you are rich or poor. Now tell me how SS/Med tax is different from general income tax?

And you are still saying lower 47% not paying any taxes?  
.......

It should be 47% doesn't pay federal income tax.  SS and Medicare are not really taxes.  They are more like an insurance policy where you may get your money back at old age.  However, the system is flawed where younger people are paying for the older people and the high wage earners paying for the low wage earners. If you study the payment schedule, you would find the payout is heavily tilted toward low wage earners.  So the poor actually getting a good deal out of it.

For the current retirees, most people are getting more than what they have paid into the system due to the extended life expectancy.  When SS was initially created, the life expectancy was around 67.   The money only needs to last for 2 years.  So right now, the future generations are paying the burden for the current retirees and the younger generation may not get anything back in the future.  That's why I think the current system is a government forced Ponzi scheme!!  Both SS and Medicare are on their way to bankruptcy.  That's really why it needs to be changed.  Of course, it is debatable on how to change it.  

I believe everyone should sacrifice a bit.  The older generation should have their benefit limited or reduced.  The future generation should have an option to opt out of the system.  I believe the retirement should be mostly depending on personal responsibilities and family responsibilities.  The government should only take care those who truly can't help themselves like disabled without family support.  The process needs to be gradual though.  Paul Ryan is proposing that the system will remain the same for the current retirees and those soon to be retired.  Then the future retirees will get a voucher to pay for their insurance.  The detail can be debated.  But this is the first plan in the right direction.

It is true that our government misused the SS trust fund.  That's another reason we should take bake the control to our own hand!  I am sure you will have a lot more money, especially for younger generation, if you put all these 15% (your portion + your employer's portion) into a bank CD.  You can never trust the government and politicians with your money!

投票

引用第103楼游客于2012-10-01 08:20发表的  :

It should be 47% doesn't pay federal income tax.  SS and Medicare are not really taxes.  They are more like an insurance policy where you may get your money back at old age.  However, the system is flawed where younger people are paying for the older people and the high wage earners paying for the low wage earners. If you study the payment schedule, you would find the payout is heavily tilted toward low wage earners.  So the poor actually getting a good deal out of it.

For the current retirees, most people are getting more than what they have paid into the system due to the extended life expectancy.  When SS was initially created, the life expectancy was around 67.   The money only needs to last for 2 years.  So right now, the future generations are paying the burden for the current retirees and the younger generation may not get anything back in the future.  That's why I think the current system is a government forced Ponzi scheme!!  Both SS and Medicare are on their way to bankruptcy.  That's really why it needs to be changed.  Of course, it is debatable on how to change it.  

.......

如果万一共和党保罗瑞安获胜，那我们还要相信共和党执政的政府吗？